Eco Freaks at it again

Locked for reading and searching only.
Locked
User avatar
TonyNokes
BFix Locked and Loaded
BFix Locked and Loaded
Posts: 538
Joined: Mon Mar 18, 2002 4:16 pm
Location: Portland, Oregon

Eco Freaks at it again

Post by TonyNokes » Thu Dec 02, 2004 3:07 pm

FYI

-----Original Message-----
From: Dan Jacobson, Environment California Legislative Director
[mailto:DanJ@environmentcalifornia.org]
Sent: Thursday, December 02, 2004 12:47 PM
To: tonynokes@freightliner.com
Subject: Environment California : don't let our Governor become the
timbernator


Dear Environment California supporter,

The battle for our forests lands continues. You did a great job last week
submitting letters to the editor, and a whopping 17 letters were printed
this weekend in papers up and down the state.

In our meeting with the Governor this Monday I handed in all the letters to
make sure his staff saw them. Unfortunately, there is a lot of pressure from
timber and mining interests to open up many of these areas for drilling and
mining. We have heard this issue has risen to the top of concerns for the
Governor - largely because of your emails and letters - and in the cabinet
meeting on Thursday they will be discussing this very issue.

Now, more than ever before, we need to keep the pressure up. We can't let
our Governor become the "timbernator." This time, the Governor needs to
really see how important national forests are to Californians. If you have
a picture of friends or family at a national forest enjoying the outdoors,
please take a moment to send a copy of this picture to the Governor, along
with a note saying "Don't become the timbernator. Please uphold the Roadless
Rule."

You can send your picture and note to the Governor by sending an email at
governor@governor.ca.gov, a fax at 916-445-4633, or snail mail to:

Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger
State Capitol Building
Sacramento, CA 95814

After you've sent your picture, let me know by clicking on the link below so
we can keep track of how many pictures have been sent in:
http://environmentcalifornia.org/enviro ... 244&id4=ES

To view the letters that were printed this weekend, click on the links below
(you'll have to fill out a free registration with some of the papers):
http://www.latimes.com/news/printeditio ... 1nov28,1,2
714883.story

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.c ... 2004/11/27
/EDGDRA29KQ1.DTL

http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/mercurynews/10288497.htm

Thanks again for all your support. Together we're working to make sure that
our Governor protects our national forests.


BACKGROUND

This past July, the Bush administration proposed to repeal protections for
58.5 million acres of America's pristine national forests, including 4.416
million acres in California. The Bush administration proposal would allow
many of President Bush's top campaign contributors in the timber, mining and
oil industries to log, mine, and drill in pristine areas that provide 60
million Americans with clean drinking water and provide habitat for over
1600 endangered species. Even for an administration that has weakened so
many environmental and public health protections, this proposal is extreme.

Governor Schwarzenegger recently announced that he will not seek protections
for roadless areas in California's national forests. Due to overwhelming
public outcry, he is now reconsidering his position.

The Roadless Rule was finalized after decades of scientific study, 600
public hearings, and 1.6 million comments in support of the rule. It is the
most popular conservation initiative in our nation's history; more than 2.5
million Americans have submitted comment supporting the rule. In this past
public comment period over 230,000 Californians voiced their support for
this rule, bring the total number of Californians who have supported the
rule to over 415,000.

This support has reached into every sector of society. Even major wood
products consumers like Staples, K.B. Homes and Hayward Lumber think logging
America's last pristine forests makes so little sense that they've written
the Bush administration to urge protection of America's roadless national
forests. Now, it's only extremist elements of the timber, oil and mining
industries that support logging these areas - but it's those elements that
the Bush administration is listening to.

You can take action by emailing a picture of you and your family or friends
at a national forest to the Governor at governor@governor.ca.gov, by faxing
it to 916-445-4633, or by sending it snail mail to:

Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger
State Capitol Building
Sacramento, CA 95814.

After you've sent your picture, let me know by clicking on the link below -
we like to keep track of how many pictures have been sent in:

http://environmentcalifornia.org/enviro ... 244&id4=ES

Sincerely,

Dan Jacobson
Environment California Legislative Director
DanJ@environmentcalifornia.org
http://www.EnvironmentCalifornia.org

P.S. Thanks again for your support. Please feel free to share this e-mail
with your family and friends.

----------

If you want to change your e-mail address or are getting e-mail at multiple
e-mail addresses then follow this link -
http://environmentcalifornia.org/enviro ... id6=change - to a
web page where you can change your e-mail address.

If you want us to stop sending you e-mail then follow this link -
http://environmentcalifornia.org/enviro ... id6=remove - to a
web page where you can remove yourself.



********************* BFix Site Sponsor ****************************
Cage Offroad Suspension lifts, Offroad accessories and more!
http://www.cageoffroad.com
<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
List help? http://www.broncofix.com or email to: admin@broncofix.com

User avatar
Broncoholics.com
Bfix Carb'd
Bfix Carb'd
Posts: 61
Joined: Wed Nov 10, 2004 6:22 pm
Location: Lake Elsinore, CA

Eco Freaks at it again

Post by Broncoholics.com » Thu Dec 02, 2004 3:51 pm

Just got that same email.


Scotty
www.broncoholics.com
----- Original Message -----
From: <TonyNokes@Freightliner.com>
To: <mail@broncofix.com>
Sent: Thursday, December 02, 2004 2:08 PM
Subject: [Bfix] Eco Freaks at it again


> FYI
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Dan Jacobson, Environment California Legislative Director
> [mailto:DanJ@environmentcalifornia.org]
> Sent: Thursday, December 02, 2004 12:47 PM
> To: tonynokes@freightliner.com
> Subject: Environment California : don't let our Governor become the
> timbernator
>
>
> Dear Environment California supporter,
>
> The battle for our forests lands continues. You did a great job last week
> submitting letters to the editor, and a whopping 17 letters were printed
> this weekend in papers up and down the state.
>
> In our meeting with the Governor this Monday I handed in all the letters
to
> make sure his staff saw them. Unfortunately, there is a lot of pressure
from
> timber and mining interests to open up many of these areas for drilling
and
> mining. We have heard this issue has risen to the top of concerns for the
> Governor - largely because of your emails and letters - and in the cabinet
> meeting on Thursday they will be discussing this very issue.
>
> Now, more than ever before, we need to keep the pressure up. We can't let
> our Governor become the "timbernator." This time, the Governor needs to
> really see how important national forests are to Californians. If you
have
> a picture of friends or family at a national forest enjoying the outdoors,
> please take a moment to send a copy of this picture to the Governor, along
> with a note saying "Don't become the timbernator. Please uphold the
Roadless
> Rule."
>
> You can send your picture and note to the Governor by sending an email at
> governor@governor.ca.gov, a fax at 916-445-4633, or snail mail to:
>
> Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger
> State Capitol Building
> Sacramento, CA 95814
>
> After you've sent your picture, let me know by clicking on the link below
so
> we can keep track of how many pictures have been sent in:
> http://environmentcalifornia.org/enviro ... 244&id4=ES
>
> To view the letters that were printed this weekend, click on the links
below
> (you'll have to fill out a free registration with some of the papers):
>
http://www.latimes.com/news/printeditio ... 1nov28,1,2
> 714883.story
>
>
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.c ... 2004/11/27
> /EDGDRA29KQ1.DTL
>
> http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/mercurynews/10288497.htm
>
> Thanks again for all your support. Together we're working to make sure
that
> our Governor protects our national forests.
>
>
> BACKGROUND
>
> This past July, the Bush administration proposed to repeal protections for
> 58.5 million acres of America's pristine national forests, including 4.416
> million acres in California. The Bush administration proposal would allow
> many of President Bush's top campaign contributors in the timber, mining
and
> oil industries to log, mine, and drill in pristine areas that provide 60
> million Americans with clean drinking water and provide habitat for over
> 1600 endangered species. Even for an administration that has weakened so
> many environmental and public health protections, this proposal is
extreme.
>
> Governor Schwarzenegger recently announced that he will not seek
protections
> for roadless areas in California's national forests. Due to overwhelming
> public outcry, he is now reconsidering his position.
>
> The Roadless Rule was finalized after decades of scientific study, 600
> public hearings, and 1.6 million comments in support of the rule. It is
the
> most popular conservation initiative in our nation's history; more than
2.5
> million Americans have submitted comment supporting the rule. In this
past
> public comment period over 230,000 Californians voiced their support for
> this rule, bring the total number of Californians who have supported the
> rule to over 415,000.
>
> This support has reached into every sector of society. Even major wood
> products consumers like Staples, K.B. Homes and Hayward Lumber think
logging
> America's last pristine forests makes so little sense that they've written
> the Bush administration to urge protection of America's roadless national
> forests. Now, it's only extremist elements of the timber, oil and mining
> industries that support logging these areas - but it's those elements that
> the Bush administration is listening to.
>
> You can take action by emailing a picture of you and your family or
friends
> at a national forest to the Governor at governor@governor.ca.gov, by
faxing
> it to 916-445-4633, or by sending it snail mail to:
>
> Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger
> State Capitol Building
> Sacramento, CA 95814.
>
> After you've sent your picture, let me know by clicking on the link
below -
> we like to keep track of how many pictures have been sent in:
>
> http://environmentcalifornia.org/enviro ... 244&id4=ES
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Dan Jacobson
> Environment California Legislative Director
> DanJ@environmentcalifornia.org
> http://www.EnvironmentCalifornia.org
>
> P.S. Thanks again for your support. Please feel free to share this
e-mail
> with your family and friends.
>
> ----------
>
> If you want to change your e-mail address or are getting e-mail at
multiple
> e-mail addresses then follow this link -
> http://environmentcalifornia.org/enviro ... id6=change - to
a
> web page where you can change your e-mail address.
>
> If you want us to stop sending you e-mail then follow this link -
> http://environmentcalifornia.org/enviro ... id6=remove - to
a
> web page where you can remove yourself.
>
>
>
> ********************* BFix Site Sponsor ****************************
> Cage Offroad Suspension lifts, Offroad accessories and more!
> http://www.cageoffroad.com
> <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
> List help? http://www.broncofix.com or email to: admin@broncofix.com
>


********************* BFix Site Sponsor ****************************
Cage Offroad Suspension lifts, Offroad accessories and more!
http://www.cageoffroad.com
<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
List help? http://www.broncofix.com or email to: admin@broncofix.com

User avatar
TonyNokes
BFix Locked and Loaded
BFix Locked and Loaded
Posts: 538
Joined: Mon Mar 18, 2002 4:16 pm
Location: Portland, Oregon

Eco Freaks at it again

Post by TonyNokes » Thu Dec 02, 2004 4:59 pm

Not necessarily a good thing but this is just one more way they Serria Club types are limiting our access to public lands.
It also doesn't occur to many people that restricting the pool of forest land available for logging focuses the logging on smaller areas giving them less time to recover. It also has the effect of increasing irresponsible logging in foreign countries (rain forests, and truly old growth areas).  At least in North America logging is a mature industry that has sound logging practices.
If people really want to save trees then quit building the McMansions, and start recycling. 
Regards, Tony
-----Original Message-----
From: res1pllg@verizon.net [mailto:res1pllg@verizon.net (res1pllg@verizon.net)]
Sent: Thursday, December 02, 2004 3:25 PM
To: TonyNokes@Freightliner.com; mail@broncofix.com
Subject: Re: [Bfix] Eco Freaks at it again

So drilling, mining and logging 60 million more acres of national forest would be a good thing?  I'm confused here.
CraigS
Gresham, OR

User avatar
TonyNokes
BFix Locked and Loaded
BFix Locked and Loaded
Posts: 538
Joined: Mon Mar 18, 2002 4:16 pm
Location: Portland, Oregon

Eco Freaks at it again

Post by TonyNokes » Fri Dec 03, 2004 10:49 am

Ahhh, good point!
However logging operations usually only limit access during active logging operations in a specific area, and mining usually only closes a small area, whereas the alternative is the entire forest will be closed unless you choose to hike in. I actually do more hiking than off highway driving anymore but I like the option to do either.  
I think the implication of sending pictures implies that it is open but only to hiking (at least that's my understanding).
 
Tony

-----Original Message-----
From: Craig Schaefer [mailto:craig.schaefer@verizon.net]
Sent: Thursday, December 02, 2004 5:13 PM
To: TonyNokes@Freightliner.com
Cc: mail@broncofix.com
Subject: Re: [Bfix] Eco Freaks at it again


But forests will be closed to access by the loggers, miners and drillers.  My only point here is that it doesn't matter who closed the forest when it's closed to recreational access.   Note in the original message that we should send pics of us enjoying the forest, implying that it is open.

CraigS
Gresham, OR



TonyNokes@Freightliner.com (tonynokes@freightliner.com) wrote:

Not necessarily a good thing but this is just one more way they Serria Club types are limiting our access to public lands.
It also doesn't occur to many people that restricting the pool of forest land available for logging focuses the logging on smaller areas giving them less time to recover. It also has the effect of increasing irresponsible logging in foreign countries (rain forests, and truly old growth areas).  At least in North America logging is a mature industry that has sound logging practices.
If people really want to save trees then quit building the McMansions, and start recycling. 
Regards, Tony
-----Original Message-----
From: res1pllg@verizon.net (res1pllg@verizon.net) [mailto:res1pllg@verizon.net (res1pllg@verizon.net)]
Sent: Thursday, December 02, 2004 3:25 PM
To: TonyNokes@Freightliner.com (tonynokes@freightliner.com); mail@broncofix.com (mail@broncofix.com)
Subject: Re: [Bfix] Eco Freaks at it again

So drilling, mining and logging 60 million more acres of national forest would be a good thing?  I'm confused here.
CraigS
Gresham, OR

User avatar
hest
BFix Locked and Loaded
BFix Locked and Loaded
Posts: 801
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2002 4:48 pm
Location: NorCal

Eco Freaks at it again

Post by hest » Fri Dec 03, 2004 11:53 am

Some interesting points by everyone. I do (or used to do) a lot of hiking and mountain biking. Some of my favorite places to go required crossing private lands to access them, but in those cases the Forest Service had had easements for decades. Unfortunately for a variety of reasons, those areas have become practically speaking off limits. New corporate owners decided they didn't want to honor the easements, which though unfortunate for us users is their prerogative, but also in at least one case public lands were closed to keep people away from extraction activities taking place. The problem is that to get to the land behind the closed places huge detours are required. The odd effect of that is that the lands behind those areas are now like wilderness, because no one goes there anymore.

Lars Pedersen
Davis, CA

At 09:50 12/03/2004 -0800, TonyNokes@Freightliner.com wrote:
Ahhh, good point!
However logging operations usually only limit access during active logging operations in a specific area, and mining usually only closes a small area, whereas the alternative is the entire forest will be closed unless you choose to hike in. I actually do more hiking than off highway driving anymore but I like the option to do either.  
I think the implication of sending pictures implies that it is open but only to hiking (at least that's my understanding).
 
Tony
-----Original Message-----
From:[/b] Craig Schaefer [mailto:craig.schaefer@verizon.net (craig.schaefer@verizon.net)]
Sent:[/b] Thursday, December 02, 2004 5:13 PM
To:[/b] TonyNokes@Freightliner.com
Cc:[/b] mail@broncofix.com
Subject:[/b] Re: [Bfix] Eco Freaks at it again

But forests will be closed to access by the loggers, miners and drillers.  My only point here is that it doesn't matter who closed the forest when it's closed to recreational access.   Note in the original message that we should send pics of us enjoying the forest, implying that it is open.

CraigS
Gresham, OR



TonyNokes@Freightliner.com (tonynokes@freightliner.com) wrote:
Not necessarily a good thing but this is just one more way they Serria Club types are limiting our[/u] access to public lands.

It also doesn't occur to many people that restricting the pool of forest land available for logging focuses the logging on smaller areas giving them less time to recover. It also has the effect of increasing irresponsible logging in foreign countries (rain forests, and truly old growth areas).  At least in North America logging is a mature industry that has sound logging practices.

If people really want to save trees then quit building the McMansions, and start recycling. 

Regards, Tony

-----Original Message-----
From: res1pllg@verizon.net (res1pllg@verizon.net) [mailto:res1pllg@verizon.net (res1pllg@verizon.net)[/u]]
Sent: Thursday, December 02, 2004 3:25 PM
To: TonyNokes@Freightliner.com (tonynokes@freightliner.com); mail@broncofix.com (mail@broncofix.com)
Subject: Re: [Bfix] Eco Freaks at it again

So drilling, mining and logging 60 million more acres of national forest would be a good thing?  I'm confused here.

CraigS
Gresham, OR

User avatar
ntsqd
BFix Locked and Loaded
BFix Locked and Loaded
Posts: 2303
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2002 9:13 pm
Location: It's dark & my GPS' batteries are dead.

Eco Freaks at it again

Post by ntsqd » Fri Dec 03, 2004 12:42 pm

My understanding of any easement, be it on the books or due to apathy,
is that once established (& you can prove it was there) that the land
owner can not suddenly deny access.

There was a case in Oxnard, CA where the PO of a piece of beach front
property allowed people to access the beach down his sideyard. New
owners moved in and closed it off. This was the only access for blocks
in either direction. The subsequent suit forced the new owner to either
re-open the access or buy equivelent property nearby for such access.

--- Lars Pedersen <lpedersen@ucdavis.edu> wrote:


---------------------------------
Some interesting points by everyone. I do (or used to do) a lot of
hikingand mountain biking. Some of my favorite places to go required
crossingprivate lands to access them, but in those cases the Forest
Service hadhad easements for decades. Unfortunately for a variety of
reasons, thoseareas have become practically speaking off limits. New
corporate ownersdecided they didn't want to honor the easements, which
though unfortunatefor us users is their prerogative, but also in at
least one case publiclands were closed to keep people away from
extraction activities takingplace. The problem is that to get to the
land behind the closed placeshuge detours are required. The odd effect
of that is that the landsbehind those areas are now like wilderness,
because no one goes thereanymore.

Lars Pedersen
Davis, CA

At 09:50 12/03/2004 -0800, TonyNokes@Freightliner.com wrote:
Ahhh,good point!
However logging operations usually only limitaccess during active
logging operations in a specific area, and miningusually only closes a
small area, whereas the alternative is the entireforest will be closed
unless you choose to hike in. I actually do morehiking than off highway
driving anymore but I like the option to doeither.
I think the implication of sending picturesimplies that it is open but
only to hiking (at least that's myunderstanding).

Tony

-----Original Message-----

From: Craig Schaefer[mailto:craig.schaefer@verizon.net]

Sent: Thursday, December 02, 2004 5:13 PM

To: TonyNokes@Freightliner.com

Cc: mail@broncofix.com

Subject: Re: [Bfix] Eco Freaks at it again


But forests will be closed to access by the loggers, miners
anddrillers. My only point here is that it doesn't matter who
closedthe forest when it's closed to recreational access. Note inthe
original message that we should send pics of us enjoying the
forest,implying that it is open.


CraigS

Gresham, OR




TonyNokes@Freightliner.comwrote:


Not necessarily a good thing but this is just one more way they
Serria Club types are limiting our access to public lands.


It also doesn't occur to many people that restricting the pool of
forest land available for logging focuses the logging on smaller areas
giving them less time to recover. It also has the effect of increasing
irresponsible logging in foreign countries (rain forests, and truly old
growth areas). At least in North America logging is a mature industry
that has sound logging practices.


If people really want to save trees then quit building the
McMansions, and start recycling.


Regards, Tony


-----Original Message-----

From: res1pllg@verizon.net [mailto:res1pllg@verizon.net]

Sent: Thursday, December 02, 2004 3:25 PM

To: TonyNokes@Freightliner.com; mail@broncofix.com

Subject: Re: [Bfix] Eco Freaks at it again


So drilling, mining and logging 60 million more acres of national
forest would be a good thing? I'm confused here.


CraigS

Gresham, OR ********************* BFix Site Sponsor
****************************Cage Offroad Suspension lifts,
Offroad accessories and more!http://www.cageoffroad.comList help?
http://www.broncofix.com or email to: admin@broncofix.com





__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we.
http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail
********************* BFix Site Sponsor ****************************
Cage Offroad Suspension lifts, Offroad accessories and more!
http://www.cageoffroad.com
<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
List help? http://www.broncofix.com or email to: admin@broncofix.com

User avatar
wpaeb
Bfix Carb'd
Bfix Carb'd
Posts: 68
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2002 5:46 pm
Location: Western PA
Contact:

Eco Freaks at it again

Post by wpaeb » Fri Dec 03, 2004 1:31 pm

FYI that would be front output shaft. I think they are the same
Steve


74bronco@broncoads.com wrote:
>
>
> Anyone know if the input shaft will interchange between T & J T-Cases?
> In case my terminology is wrong, the shaft that has the yoke bolted to
> it, where the front D/S connects.
>
> Thanks
>
> Craig
> Mineola, TX
> '74
> ********************* BFix Site Sponsor ****************************
> Cage Offroad Suspension lifts, Offroad accessories and more!
> http://www.cageoffroad.com
> <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
> List help? http://www.broncofix.com or email to: admin@broncofix.com
>
>

********************* BFix Site Sponsor ****************************
Cage Offroad Suspension lifts, Offroad accessories and more!
http://www.cageoffroad.com
<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
List help? http://www.broncofix.com or email to: admin@broncofix.com

Locked