Bronco '74 headlight / light problems.

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IcelandicBroncoFan
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Bronco '74 headlight / light problems.

Post by IcelandicBroncoFan » Wed Mar 27, 2013 6:47 pm

Hello, I'm new here on this forum, and I am currently restoring a 1974 Ford Bronco Sport with the 302.

It's in very rough condition from rust, the top was badly damaged, the floor is half missing, and so forth.

Rust repair is almost finished, and we got a back up Bronco 1968 I believe it is, coming in soon, to replace the top and more things.

But I am having a problem, with the headlight switch and the lights.
The problem describes itself like this : When I pulled the headlight switch to fully extended position, the headlights would come on for about 30 seconds, then go off, and wouldn't come back on unless you put the button back out.


The parking lights are fully functional (yellow lights)

The turning signals are not, I'm afraid, When I press the left turning signal, nothing happens, no light, not in the dash or on the signal itself, but when I press the right turning signal, the light comes on ( in the dash and the signal itself) but doesn't blink, just comes on, very bright.

I've determined that the light switch / unit is broken, and I'll need a replacement of that ( Was told by an experienced mechanic who owns a Bronco aswell ) And that it is a common problem in them.

I looked under the dash, and moved the light switch around, turned it, pulled it out, saw that the spring in the light switch on the inside, was giving sparks when it hit the metal around it, so I cut it off, that might have been a mistake, thoughtless mistake.

So my question is to you, where can I buy a new light switch unit and how do I remove the old one? ( See picture I posted on www.imgur.com below )

Or if there is anything else I should know, or be wary of, please tell, or if you see anything on the photo that could be fixed, because I am no expert! :)

Thanks.

http://imgur.com/iy8ApS2 - The photo of the light switch unit from inside the dash, how do I remove that?

(I hope I put this thread in the correct location, if I didn't, by all means, move it)

DirtDonk
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Post by DirtDonk » Fri Mar 29, 2013 11:01 am

Hey BroncoFan, welcome! Glad you've got your Bronco, but sorry it's giving you some trouble. And yes, both are common problems.
With both switches, the years of moisture and corrosion don't do them any good. Add cold to the problems with the plastic on the turn signal switch, and you're probably right about it failing.

Haven't looked at the pics yet, but to remove the main headlight switch you disconnect the battery (of course!), pull the knob out all the way, reach up underneath and feel with your fingers for the flat side of the switch where you'll feel a small spring-loaded button about .5 centimeter in diameter. Maybe a bit larger, but you get the idea.
Push the button while pulling on the knob and it should pop out. Even new ones however, don't always just come right out. With your old one you may very well have to wrestle it a little bit. Moving it in and out and alternating pushing the button until the knob and shaft pull out.

Once that's out, you unscrew the center bezel nut/collar with either the proper wrench or, a pair of small needle nose pliers inserted into the slots. If you choose to go with the pliers, be gentle. The nut is easily deformed. Damage is usually only cosmetic, but it's better to avoid anyway.
The headlight bezel nut is slightly different from most of the other control knobs, in that it is actually a long sleeve with the threads in the back. Most the others are just simple round nuts.
When that's off, your switch should be able to just lower out and you can disconnect the wires.

Gotta run out to help my dad right now. I'll stop back in and see if I can offer more information. Oh, and the switches themselves are readily available around here. Not sure about Iceland, but if you have sources for US auto parts, they should not have trouble getting them.
I work at Wild Horses (www.wildhorses4x4.com) and we ship that kind of thing all over the world too. If you can't find it elsewhere, please let me know and I should be able to get what you need to you.

Good luck!

Paul
'71 Bronco - 302 4v
3.5" WH/Skyjacker Lift
33 x 11.50 x15 Thornbirds on 15x7 Enkei's
Kayline soft top
Hanson bumpers
Dual batteries, Large 1G alt.

WWW.WILDHORSES4X4.COM :mrgreen:

IcelandicBroncoFan
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Post by IcelandicBroncoFan » Fri Mar 29, 2013 1:16 pm

DirtDonk wrote:Hey BroncoFan, welcome! Glad you've got your Bronco, but sorry it's giving you some trouble. And yes, both are common problems.
With both switches, the years of moisture and corrosion don't do them any good. Add cold to the problems with the plastic on the turn signal switch, and you're probably right about it failing.

Haven't looked at the pics yet, but to remove the main headlight switch you disconnect the battery (of course!), pull the knob out all the way, reach up underneath and feel with your fingers for the flat side of the switch where you'll feel a small spring-loaded button about .5 centimeter in diameter. Maybe a bit larger, but you get the idea.
Push the button while pulling on the knob and it should pop out. Even new ones however, don't always just come right out. With your old one you may very well have to wrestle it a little bit. Moving it in and out and alternating pushing the button until the knob and shaft pull out.

Once that's out, you unscrew the center bezel nut/collar with either the proper wrench or, a pair of small needle nose pliers inserted into the slots. If you choose to go with the pliers, be gentle. The nut is easily deformed. Damage is usually only cosmetic, but it's better to avoid anyway.
The headlight bezel nut is slightly different from most of the other control knobs, in that it is actually a long sleeve with the threads in the back. Most the others are just simple round nuts.
When that's off, your switch should be able to just lower out and you can disconnect the wires.

Gotta run out to help my dad right now. I'll stop back in and see if I can offer more information. Oh, and the switches themselves are readily available around here. Not sure about Iceland, but if you have sources for US auto parts, they should not have trouble getting them.
I work at Wild Horses (www.wildhorses4x4.com) and we ship that kind of thing all over the world too. If you can't find it elsewhere, please let me know and I should be able to get what you need to you.

Good luck!

Paul
Thanks for replying, Paul!
I'll take a look at that when it is time ( When the other Bronco gets here )

I also got another question, the 'Brake' light on the dash, is constantly on when the car is switched on, the brakes were just recently fixed at a workshop.
Why is it constantly on if the brakes are working as they should?

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Post by DirtDonk » Fri Mar 29, 2013 2:03 pm

Also a common failure with what was supposed to be a simple system, but is subject to water intrusion into the brake fluid over the years and the subsequent "sticking" of the piston.
The light indicated that there is (or was) an imbalance between the front and rear brake lines. Either from a leak, or from the bleeding process during maintenance.
If that's fixed or verified to be good, you've at least got nothing to worry about except for the light itself. That's the good news.
The bad news is that sometimes they just don't reset themselves like they're supposed to. What you can do to try to re-center the piston (this is inside the "H-block" on the frame we're talking about) is to press very hard on the brake pedal to see if the pressures will equalize and turn off the light. If that doesn't work, then either the fault lies in a stuck piston or something wrong with the main ignition switch itself. The switch is where the light circuit get's the temporary grounding "proof-out" during START only.

So, the things to do are:

1. Press hard on the brake pedal to see if that does it. If not...
2. Pull the H-block apart and try to free up the piston so that it's free to move and re-center itself when it's all put back together. If that doesn't work...
3. Check that the ignition cylinder is not constantly grounded through the one side terminal where the Pink or Purple (I forget what color it is) is attached. If you find it at fault, replace the switch. If that's not it...
4. Pull the wire off the switch or pull the bulb out until such time as you either fix it, or convert the light to some other type of indicator. Such as a parking brake ON light.

Hope that helps.

Paul
'71 Bronco - 302 4v
3.5" WH/Skyjacker Lift
33 x 11.50 x15 Thornbirds on 15x7 Enkei's
Kayline soft top
Hanson bumpers
Dual batteries, Large 1G alt.

WWW.WILDHORSES4X4.COM :mrgreen:

DirtDonk
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Re: Bronco '74 headlight / light problems.

Post by DirtDonk » Fri Mar 29, 2013 2:22 pm

Ok, back to some of the other details I missed.
IcelandicBroncoFan wrote:But I am having a problem, with the headlight switch and the lights.
The problem describes itself like this : When I pulled the headlight switch to fully extended position, the headlights would come on for about 30 seconds, then go off, and wouldn't come back on unless you put the button back out.
As you may already have figured out, the headlight switch has it's own internal circuit breaker and is probably just old and tripping the breaker.
The only cure for this is to get a new switch, like you were already thinking.
With all the power having to travel all the way from the battery to the switch and back out to the lights (no relays) any little thing added to the old age can build up enough resistance to not only give you dim headlights, but continually trip the circuit-breaker.
Adding relays into the system is something we do a lot these days. Most modern vehicles use them. So why not us. Right?

The headlight switch gets it's power directly from the battery via a splice in the harness. The brake lights get their power from the headlight switch. So things can get a little strange at any time.

IcelandicBroncoFan wrote:The turning signals are not (functional), I'm afraid, When I press the left turning signal, nothing happens, no light, not in the dash or on the signal itself, but when I press the right turning signal, the light comes on ( in the dash and the signal itself) but doesn't blink, just comes on, very bright.
While the turn signal switch is definitely a common issue at this age, an even more common issue with Early Broncos is that the grounding scheme (do you use the term "earth" instead of "ground" in Iceland?) was never very comprehensive to begin with. Add years of rust between body panels, corrosion on the wiring, connectors coming loose or broken or also corroded, and any number of other changes by previous owners (PO's) and you have a recipe for a very poor performing electrical system.
So one of the things I can wholeheartedly recommend would be to make sure you have good existing ground connections, then add several more of your own to various panels using simple jumper wires or cables or braided straps. Whatever you have will work better than what it's got.

So, you probably know all this already, having dealt with different kinds of vehicles, but just for the purpose of discussion, I'll mention a few key points.
1. The main ground cable from the battery should be attached directly to the engine block. As close as you can to the starter is best.
2. A secondary wire of at least 10 gauge should go from the battery negative to a nearby body panel. The fender is where Ford put it.
3. An additional ground strap/cable/wire should attach between the engine and the firewall. Usually a bolt on top of the intake manifold to a bolt on the firewall will suffice. I just clean a bit of paint off, drill a hole and put a new screw in. Or sometimes just use a self-tapping screw in the same manner. Works great.
4. Another ground strap should go from any one of those items to the main frame rail. I usually attach one from the engine block to the frame up front and one from the body to the frame in the back.
And still more...
5. A big problem area is the dashboard. I make a simple jumper wire with ring terminals at both ends and attach one end to the body/firewall area somewhere underneath the dash to anywhere on the dash. Straight to the instrument cluster works, but I usually use a separate wire for that.
6. With the dash grounded separately, run another short wire from the dash to the instrument cluster. A great spot for this is to the mounting screw that holds the IVR (instrument voltage regulator) or "constant voltage supply" (a funny misnomer) to the instrument cluster back plate.
7. Nope, not done yet. One last ground wire should be attached from the windshield frame to the body or the dash. Either will do at this point.

Now, with all those additional grounding circuits to help re-connect 40 year old rusty body parts together, you can stop chasing your tail while trying to track down electrical gremlins.

IcelandicBroncoFan wrote:(I hope I put this thread in the correct location, if I didn't, by all means, move it)
Not a problem that I can see. With all the issues you're going to be dealing with, it could gone equally as well in any of the categories I would say. We'll try to help no matter where we have to look for it.

Paul
'71 Bronco - 302 4v
3.5" WH/Skyjacker Lift
33 x 11.50 x15 Thornbirds on 15x7 Enkei's
Kayline soft top
Hanson bumpers
Dual batteries, Large 1G alt.

WWW.WILDHORSES4X4.COM :mrgreen:

DirtDonk
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Post by DirtDonk » Fri Mar 29, 2013 2:36 pm

In your picture, the release button on the light switch would be in the upper left side (10 o'clock position) on the top of the flat metal portion of the switch.
The Light Purple wire for the brake warning light is there on the side of the ignition switch.
Your Bronco should have 2 flasher units/relays, so if you're not getting any blinking of the turn signals or emergency flashers, try swapping out one or both for known good ones. Or at least swap them into the other position with each other. The colors are different, but the function and the connectors are compatible.
The Light Blue flasher unit in your picture should be the turn-signal flasher.

Paul
'71 Bronco - 302 4v
3.5" WH/Skyjacker Lift
33 x 11.50 x15 Thornbirds on 15x7 Enkei's
Kayline soft top
Hanson bumpers
Dual batteries, Large 1G alt.

WWW.WILDHORSES4X4.COM :mrgreen:

IcelandicBroncoFan
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Post by IcelandicBroncoFan » Fri Mar 29, 2013 4:30 pm

DirtDonk wrote:In your picture, the release button on the light switch would be in the upper left side (10 o'clock position) on the top of the flat metal portion of the switch.
The Light Purple wire for the brake warning light is there on the side of the ignition switch.
Your Bronco should have 2 flasher units/relays, so if you're not getting any blinking of the turn signals or emergency flashers, try swapping out one or both for known good ones. Or at least swap them into the other position with each other. The colors are different, but the function and the connectors are compatible.
The Light Blue flasher unit in your picture should be the turn-signal flasher.

Paul
Wow! Thanks so much for all of this info, you're a lifesaver ;)
I'll take a look at that, and replace the blinker relays.

Sorry for flooding you with questions, but I got more!

The front windshield should be able to move down onto the hood, right?
Because I would need to get rid of that black 'plastic' above the dash, because that window frame is extremely rusty, from the inside.

No matter what I try, it looks like I cannot move the front windshield frame down onto the hood, I can see the hinges, but it looks like it has never ever been moved, and I'm afraid of breaking it.

How could i move it without risking possible break?

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Post by DirtDonk » Fri Mar 29, 2013 9:41 pm

After the '69 model year when the electric windshield wipers were added, it was quite a bit harder to lower the windshield because of the wiring harness routed up through the channel. It can still be done, but it's harder just due to that, even when the hinge is working well. Make sure you remove the two large bolts though, one at each end of the dash pad. Once those are removed and the top is unbolted from the frame, it should rotate forward for the first few inches without much trouble. Since yours seems stuck, it's either the stuck hinge or someone put a hidden screw or two into the frame where you can't see it. That would be unusual of course, but certainly not unheard of. It's crazy what some people do. Although, if this Bronco has spent it's whole life in your country, I would think the previous owners were probably more sensible with their vehicles than a lot of PO's around here seem to be!

Sounds most like your hinge is just rusty. Since you're trying to remove it anyway, I would spray some penetrating oil or rust-breaker (if there is such a thing?) into the entire hinge area. It will likely make a mess on the top of the cowl, but at this point that's the last of your worries.
Your '74 probably has it's hinge spot-welded to the cowl/body, so if it brakes, it brakes. You might have to change it out anyway if it's all rusty. The hinge itself is readily available, but I'm almost more afraid of what you'll find underneath when you do get the windshield off!
That whole area between the door "A-pillars" and about 6 inches past the firewall in the engine compartment was not one of Ford's "Better Ideas" as far as most of us are concerned. It was a magnet for water and the ensuing rust. Some are lucky, most are not. Good luck on yours. We're rooting for you!

Paul
'71 Bronco - 302 4v
3.5" WH/Skyjacker Lift
33 x 11.50 x15 Thornbirds on 15x7 Enkei's
Kayline soft top
Hanson bumpers
Dual batteries, Large 1G alt.

WWW.WILDHORSES4X4.COM :mrgreen:

IcelandicBroncoFan
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Post by IcelandicBroncoFan » Sat Mar 30, 2013 4:45 pm

DirtDonk wrote:After the '69 model year when the electric windshield wipers were added, it was quite a bit harder to lower the windshield because of the wiring harness routed up through the channel. It can still be done, but it's harder just due to that, even when the hinge is working well. Make sure you remove the two large bolts though, one at each end of the dash pad. Once those are removed and the top is unbolted from the frame, it should rotate forward for the first few inches without much trouble. Since yours seems stuck, it's either the stuck hinge or someone put a hidden screw or two into the frame where you can't see it. That would be unusual of course, but certainly not unheard of. It's crazy what some people do. Although, if this Bronco has spent it's whole life in your country, I would think the previous owners were probably more sensible with their vehicles than a lot of PO's around here seem to be!

Sounds most like your hinge is just rusty. Since you're trying to remove it anyway, I would spray some penetrating oil or rust-breaker (if there is such a thing?) into the entire hinge area. It will likely make a mess on the top of the cowl, but at this point that's the last of your worries.
Your '74 probably has it's hinge spot-welded to the cowl/body, so if it brakes, it brakes. You might have to change it out anyway if it's all rusty. The hinge itself is readily available, but I'm almost more afraid of what you'll find underneath when you do get the windshield off!
That whole area between the door "A-pillars" and about 6 inches past the firewall in the engine compartment was not one of Ford's "Better Ideas" as far as most of us are concerned. It was a magnet for water and the ensuing rust. Some are lucky, most are not. Good luck on yours. We're rooting for you!

Paul
Thanks, I'm a little nervous to try that, because I want to get it up and running before summer! I'll perhaps try that next winter, when we try and fix it up a little more perhaps.

I've got one more question I need to ask you, about the automatic transmission, the C4.

When you accelerate, it shifts up, but it doesn't shift down when you accelerate fast, it doesn't pick.
What's the cause of that, and how could I fix it?

And I see you mentioned in previous posts about the brake light always being on, some H-Block, what do you mean by that?



* Added : I forgot to tell you.
My hazards work, they work perfectly on all sides, and i can hear the second relay ticking, but the blue one on my photo, I replaced that one with a new solid one, and It did nothing to my turning signals, they didn't come on at all.

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Post by DirtDonk » Sat Mar 30, 2013 8:36 pm

Hmm, I'm not a C4 expert, but that sounds like the kickdown switch is not adjusted right. Or not working at all.
Is there a round hollow rod (with flattened ends) attached between the carburetor linkage and the side of the transmission? If so, you may have to look up the adjustment procedure. I can probably find it too, so I'll look when I get the chance.
The side of the trans houses the shaft for the shift linkage, the reverse light/neutral safety switch (should have 4 wires coming from it) and the kickdown mechanism.
Do your backup lamps work? Will the engine start in gear or does it give you trouble sometimes if you don't jiggle the shift lever? That's usually indicative of a worn out NSS (neutral safety switch) but I'm not sure how they're all related to each other mechanically.
Someone here may know and chime in.

Of course, with C4's you have to keep the fluid up to it's proper level. If it gets even a little low, it will tend to slide itself out of gear when you're on a hill. Not sure if that also effects the down-shifting performance, but it might have a relationship.

Regarding the turn signals then, it's sounding more and more like the switch itself is bad. But you can double check to make sure that at least one of the wires going to that blue relay/flasher unit is getting power when the key is ON. That would let you know that power is at least getting part of the way.

Paul
'71 Bronco - 302 4v
3.5" WH/Skyjacker Lift
33 x 11.50 x15 Thornbirds on 15x7 Enkei's
Kayline soft top
Hanson bumpers
Dual batteries, Large 1G alt.

WWW.WILDHORSES4X4.COM :mrgreen:

IcelandicBroncoFan
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Post by IcelandicBroncoFan » Sat Apr 13, 2013 12:02 pm

DirtDonk wrote:Hmm, I'm not a C4 expert, but that sounds like the kickdown switch is not adjusted right. Or not working at all.
Is there a round hollow rod (with flattened ends) attached between the carburetor linkage and the side of the transmission? If so, you may have to look up the adjustment procedure. I can probably find it too, so I'll look when I get the chance.
The side of the trans houses the shaft for the shift linkage, the reverse light/neutral safety switch (should have 4 wires coming from it) and the kickdown mechanism.
Do your backup lamps work? Will the engine start in gear or does it give you trouble sometimes if you don't jiggle the shift lever? That's usually indicative of a worn out NSS (neutral safety switch) but I'm not sure how they're all related to each other mechanically.
Someone here may know and chime in.

Of course, with C4's you have to keep the fluid up to it's proper level. If it gets even a little low, it will tend to slide itself out of gear when you're on a hill. Not sure if that also effects the down-shifting performance, but it might have a relationship.

Regarding the turn signals then, it's sounding more and more like the switch itself is bad. But you can double check to make sure that at least one of the wires going to that blue relay/flasher unit is getting power when the key is ON. That would let you know that power is at least getting part of the way.

Paul
Thanks for replying.

I've got another question to throw at you, you seem to know it all ;)

I've noticed it runs really fast, I don't think it's normal.

When I start it, it's really bad, I have to keep pushing the throttle in for like atleast 2-3 minutes until it can run by itself, suspecting the carburetor for that, but I have no idea how to fix that, not familiar with that.

Lets say, I start it in Park, I give it more throttle for a few minutes, until it runs by itself normally, and then I would proceed putting it in Drive, and when I put it in Drive, I feel a sharp pull, or like a 'clonk' and the tires squeek and it flies forward, unless I push the brake really hard.

It's the same with Reverse and Drive.

I'm just not sure what's causing it, but I doubt it's normal that whenever i put it in Drive, it's like if you would have drove into a curb kind of feeling.

If i don't push the break really hard while shifting to Drive, it literally burns rubber and flies forward leaving whatever is behind in smoke ;)

Is this normal?

IcelandicBroncoFan
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Post by IcelandicBroncoFan » Sat Apr 13, 2013 5:27 pm

IcelandicBroncoFan wrote:
DirtDonk wrote:Hmm, I'm not a C4 expert, but that sounds like the kickdown switch is not adjusted right. Or not working at all.
Is there a round hollow rod (with flattened ends) attached between the carburetor linkage and the side of the transmission? If so, you may have to look up the adjustment procedure. I can probably find it too, so I'll look when I get the chance.
The side of the trans houses the shaft for the shift linkage, the reverse light/neutral safety switch (should have 4 wires coming from it) and the kickdown mechanism.
Do your backup lamps work? Will the engine start in gear or does it give you trouble sometimes if you don't jiggle the shift lever? That's usually indicative of a worn out NSS (neutral safety switch) but I'm not sure how they're all related to each other mechanically.
Someone here may know and chime in.

Of course, with C4's you have to keep the fluid up to it's proper level. If it gets even a little low, it will tend to slide itself out of gear when you're on a hill. Not sure if that also effects the down-shifting performance, but it might have a relationship.

Regarding the turn signals then, it's sounding more and more like the switch itself is bad. But you can double check to make sure that at least one of the wires going to that blue relay/flasher unit is getting power when the key is ON. That would let you know that power is at least getting part of the way.

Paul
Thanks for replying.

I've got another question to throw at you, you seem to know it all ;)

I've noticed it runs really fast, I don't think it's normal.

When I start it, it's really bad, I have to keep pushing the throttle in for like atleast 2-3 minutes until it can run by itself, suspecting the carburetor for that, but I have no idea how to fix that, not familiar with that.

Lets say, I start it in Park, I give it more throttle for a few minutes, until it runs by itself normally, and then I would proceed putting it in Drive, and when I put it in Drive, I feel a sharp pull, or like a 'clonk' and the tires squeek and it flies forward, unless I push the brake really hard.

It's the same with Reverse and Drive.

I'm just not sure what's causing it, but I doubt it's normal that whenever i put it in Drive, it's like if you would have drove into a curb kind of feeling.

If i don't push the break really hard while shifting to Drive, it literally burns rubber and flies forward leaving whatever is behind in smoke ;)

Is this normal?
Considering you must own a Bronco too, what does it consume? Don't know how you say it there, Mileage? per 100km? How many liters?

DirtDonk
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Post by DirtDonk » Sun Apr 14, 2013 7:56 pm

Hey Iceland. Sorry I missed your previous question too.
For this latest one though, if you can do a conversion from miles-per-gallon to kilometers-per-liter, we typically get between 8 to 10 mpg while on short drives, but out on the open roads we have around here (not sure about where you are) they can get from 13 to 17 mpg with the V8 engines. That's with very steady speed driving at a modest speed like 55 to 60 miles-per-hour or so.

With your Bronco running a bit off right now, and with that high speed idle from your previous question, I would not expect more than say 9 mpg or so.
I'm guessing it's pretty thirsty right now?
Oh, and I don't know how you "grade" your fuel there, but they can normally run fine on as low as 87 Octane ("research octane" here) to about 93 Octane. You would normally not need the higher octane unless you had a higher performance version, or there was some problem with the way it ran.

Paul
'71 Bronco - 302 4v
3.5" WH/Skyjacker Lift
33 x 11.50 x15 Thornbirds on 15x7 Enkei's
Kayline soft top
Hanson bumpers
Dual batteries, Large 1G alt.

WWW.WILDHORSES4X4.COM :mrgreen:

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Post by DirtDonk » Sun Apr 14, 2013 8:10 pm

Regarding your other question about the cold performance. That sounds like you have some adjustments to make with the carburetor and it's choke system.
But first, with the air-cleaner housing removed, manipulate the throttle lever to see if the choke valve closes almost completely. If it does, good.
There is usually (but not on all carburetors) a "choke pull-off" vacuum pot that, when the engine starts, pulls the choke open just slightly. Maybe a half of an inch at the most. If this seems to be correct, good.

The high idle is often some of the little linkage pieces under the choke coil being stuck. Easiest way to tell is to spray them with a good carb-cleaner, then spray them with a light lubricant. If they are still adjusted properly, this will usually un-stick things and they will work correctly.
There is also a "high-idle" screw down under there as well. It was possibly set too high the last time it was adjusted. It's very hard to get to, but if you open the throttle all the way (with the engine off of course) you can sometimes get a small wrench or screwdriver on it (or even a small finger?) to turn it down slightly (looser, or left) to lower the high-idle.

There are usually four main adjusting screws on the carb. The main, or "curb idle" speed screw on the throttle linkage. The two "idle air" mixture adjusting screws on the front lower part of the carb, and that last little high-idle speed screw on the choke.
Many Broncos also had an electric solenoid pushing on the linkage. This was an "anti-dieseling" solenoid and, when present, was used to set the curb idle (also called base idle) speed. In cases where the solenoid is used, the idle speed is set with this solenoid to about 800 to 900 rpm (for an automatic transmission), and the curb-idle screw was set at a lower rpm of about 500. This helped to shut off the flow of fuel when the key was turned off, to avoid any run-on, or "dieseling" when shutting down a hot engine.

To verify that your main idle speed screw is set, you may need a tachometer if you can't tell by ear what speed your engine is idling at. But the exact number is not as important as what it feels like. With that jump and clunk when putting it in Drive or Reverse, I would just turn the speed down until you like the way it runs.
Once you have the choke cleaned and working properly that is.

There are probably some good tutorials online somewhere, for both adjusting and rebuilding carbs. Each one is slightly different of course, but the basics apply almost across the spectrum.
Good luck. Hope you get it working.

Can you post up some pictures of your carb setup? With out the air-cleaner housing installed?

Thanks

Paul
'71 Bronco - 302 4v
3.5" WH/Skyjacker Lift
33 x 11.50 x15 Thornbirds on 15x7 Enkei's
Kayline soft top
Hanson bumpers
Dual batteries, Large 1G alt.

WWW.WILDHORSES4X4.COM :mrgreen:

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Post by IcelandicBroncoFan » Tue Apr 16, 2013 12:01 pm

DirtDonk wrote:Regarding your other question about the cold performance. That sounds like you have some adjustments to make with the carburetor and it's choke system.
But first, with the air-cleaner housing removed, manipulate the throttle lever to see if the choke valve closes almost completely. If it does, good.
There is usually (but not on all carburetors) a "choke pull-off" vacuum pot that, when the engine starts, pulls the choke open just slightly. Maybe a half of an inch at the most. If this seems to be correct, good.

The high idle is often some of the little linkage pieces under the choke coil being stuck. Easiest way to tell is to spray them with a good carb-cleaner, then spray them with a light lubricant. If they are still adjusted properly, this will usually un-stick things and they will work correctly.
There is also a "high-idle" screw down under there as well. It was possibly set too high the last time it was adjusted. It's very hard to get to, but if you open the throttle all the way (with the engine off of course) you can sometimes get a small wrench or screwdriver on it (or even a small finger?) to turn it down slightly (looser, or left) to lower the high-idle.

There are usually four main adjusting screws on the carb. The main, or "curb idle" speed screw on the throttle linkage. The two "idle air" mixture adjusting screws on the front lower part of the carb, and that last little high-idle speed screw on the choke.
Many Broncos also had an electric solenoid pushing on the linkage. This was an "anti-dieseling" solenoid and, when present, was used to set the curb idle (also called base idle) speed. In cases where the solenoid is used, the idle speed is set with this solenoid to about 800 to 900 rpm (for an automatic transmission), and the curb-idle screw was set at a lower rpm of about 500. This helped to shut off the flow of fuel when the key was turned off, to avoid any run-on, or "dieseling" when shutting down a hot engine.

To verify that your main idle speed screw is set, you may need a tachometer if you can't tell by ear what speed your engine is idling at. But the exact number is not as important as what it feels like. With that jump and clunk when putting it in Drive or Reverse, I would just turn the speed down until you like the way it runs.
Once you have the choke cleaned and working properly that is.

There are probably some good tutorials online somewhere, for both adjusting and rebuilding carbs. Each one is slightly different of course, but the basics apply almost across the spectrum.
Good luck. Hope you get it working.

Can you post up some pictures of your carb setup? With out the air-cleaner housing installed?

Thanks

Paul
Hey Paul, thanks for the reply.

I took some photos of the setup for you, and here they are :

The tag : http://imgur.com/XFwSLt8,80AY3Qz,xSFqxS5,kMvqKde
Left side: http://imgur.com/XFwSLt8,80AY3Qz,xSFqxS5,kMvqKde#2
Right side : http://imgur.com/XFwSLt8,80AY3Qz,xSFqxS5,kMvqKde#1
Front : http://imgur.com/kT7kzS4
Above : http://imgur.com/XFwSLt8,80AY3Qz,xSFqxS5,kMvqKde#3

Could you perhaps point out to me the 'high-idle' screw, that's probably my main concern at the moment?

And the thing in the plastic casing on the left side of the carburator, (the choke housing?), that can set the air / fuel mixture?

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Post by DirtDonk » Tue Apr 16, 2013 12:39 pm

In a way, I suppose it does "set the mixture" but it's only a temporary setting until the bi-metallic spring unloads the choke plate (also called the "butterfly") and opens it back up when warm.
The real idle mixture settings are the two screws that are very hard to see underneath the front casting of the carburetor (where the float bowl extends and the filter sticks out in the front). With the distributor cap usually in the way of a good view, you have to twist your neck around and bend over to see them. But they're there.

Well, by your images it's obvious that the carb has not been cleaned in a very long time. It could probably use a very good cleaning and simple rebuild. Make sure you keep that little house-shaped red identity tag! To source parts and basic rebuild kits those numbers will be very helpful.

Were the pictures taken with the engine cold or fully warmed up? If cold, I see your problem right away. Your choke plate/valve/butterfly is fully open as you can see in the 3 images showing the whole carb. If cold, it should be at least partially closed (usually about half-way) and then when you press the accelerator pedal or manipulate the arm by hand, the spring under the black round choke housing/cover will close it the rest of the way.
With the plate remaining open like that, your cold starts will be very difficult. When it closes, it "chokes" off some of the air flow, thereby creating a temporarily richer mixture. This richer mixture with more fuel and less air is easier for the spark to ignite when starting cold. It gradually leans out, adding more air as the choke plate opens up or "pulls off" as the engine heats up.
In addition to engine heat, that wire connected to it (should be White w/black under that grime) takes reduced voltage from the stator "STA" connector on the alternator to heat it up a little quicker. Especially in colder climates.
You should also check voltage at that connector when the engine is running. Should be zero volts when the engine is turned off, and perhaps 8 to 10 volts when the engine is running.
In older Broncos that did not use the wire, the heater hose was routed next to the housing to get more heat.
Also, the steel tubes connected between the exhaust manifold and the carburetor aid this process and get a tiny amount of heated air directly into the intake at the same time.

The screw-in fuel filter should probably be changed as well. Around here they are very easy to find and inexpensive, so it's a common item to replace. I would guess that in your neck-of-the-woods it's not as easily acquired?

The high-idle screw is not visible in your pictures, but it is underneath the choke housing and hard to see. It might be easier to see if you open the throttle lever all the way. As you rotate the lever, you will see the linkage under the choke rotate as well, and the screw may come into view better.

I see by your pictures too, that you do have the "anti-dieseling" solenoid pushing on your throttle lever. You can see it best in the 2nd and 4th images. If you turn the key on, you should see it's rod pop out and hear a click. This is what sets your "curb idle" or just your idle speed. When adjusting, you simply loosen the lock nut(s) and rotate in the bracket. You may have to disconnect the wire to turn it more than just a little, but that's ok. Just plug it back in when you are done.
Beneath the solenoid is another screw. This sets your "base idle" speed and is the fall-back for when the key is turned off or if the solenoid ever fails.

You should verify that neither of these two items is pushing against your throttle linkage too far.
Also, it's VERY important to thoroughly clean the choke side of the carburetor so that you can see if any of that linkage is stuck. Like I mentioned before, they get gummy and stick. This can very easily be causing your high idle speed when starting.
Spray them clean and lube them, then, with the choke plate all the way open (as it is in the images now) when you push on the throttle linkage you should see the little levers under there drop to their proper positions for a warmed up engine. When this happens, your throttle linkage will drop back down and touch the solenoid.

So, you have three basic idle speeds:
1. Base idle. Set by the large screw underneath the solenoid. Set to approximately 500 rpm.
2. Curb idle. This is your normal warm idle which is set with the solenoid. Set to approximately 800-900 rpm with the transmission in neutral, or 600 rpm with it in Drive.
3. High idle. This is only when cold and the choke is at least partially closed. This varies from an initial high of approx. 1700 rpm and gradually goes down to 1400, then 1100 rpm, until warm when it defaults to the Curb idle.

With as much as that carb looks dirty, it's very easy to imagine that things are stuck and leaking to the point that you will have to do some very thorough cleaning.
In fact, if it was mine, I would cover the carb and the distributor and spray the entire engine compartment with a strong degreaser and then spray wash the entire compartment. Engine and all.
Frankly, I don't even bother to cover my distributors when I do this, because I have no issue with removing the distributor cap and blowing air inside to dry out any moisture. Then I spray the inside of the distributor with cleaner as well!

Good luck. I know this is not a complete instruction on how to fix or tune a carburetor. But it's the best I could do right now. Have to take dad to the doctors anyway, so now's a good time to stop.
Since you are now the owner of a tired old American utility vehicle, I would invest in a service manual of at least the basic Chilton's or Hayne's variety, and read up on all the little issues you're going to be tracking down and fixing in your near future.

Enjoy.

Paul
'71 Bronco - 302 4v
3.5" WH/Skyjacker Lift
33 x 11.50 x15 Thornbirds on 15x7 Enkei's
Kayline soft top
Hanson bumpers
Dual batteries, Large 1G alt.

WWW.WILDHORSES4X4.COM :mrgreen:

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Post by IcelandicBroncoFan » Wed Jun 19, 2013 7:37 pm

Just thought I'd give a little update :)

It's been running pretty well, we changed the spark plugs ( which probably haven't been changed for many many years, two of them were destroyed, and rest rusted shut ) but some oil did the trick!

We replaced the fuel filter aswell, gave the transmission new oil, engine, gearbox, and rear 'drive' or whatever the word for it is :)

Carburator overhaul is still yet to come, we are currently just enjoying it over the summer time, too bad it's a pretty rainy / cloudy summer here in Iceland :)

No more rust repairs until next winter, then we are going to change the rear fenders to the original, and change to the original rims on the tires aswell, and have them sandblasted and painted.

PS, I need a new radiator hose, the one that goes on the top right of the radiator and goes in a loop into the motor, that's pretty torn up.

Do you know of any store which would ship to Iceland which I could get that radiator hose from, as cheap as possible?

Thanks :)

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Post by Tom Dummer » Wed Jun 19, 2013 8:56 pm

[quote="

Do you know of any store which would ship to Iceland which I could get that radiator hose from, as cheap as possible?

Thanks :)[/quote]

I think your link needs to be bigger at the bottom of your posts Donk, :D
Any more help here just may require a picture of your Bronco!
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Post by IcelandicBroncoFan » Thu Jun 20, 2013 7:03 am

Tom Dummer wrote:[quote="

Do you know of any store which would ship to Iceland which I could get that radiator hose from, as cheap as possible?

Thanks :)
I think your link needs to be bigger at the bottom of your posts Donk, :D
Any more help here just may require a picture of your Bronco![/quote]
Yeah, I knew of that site, but wasn't sure if it would ship to Iceland, just wanted a confirmation :)

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Post by DirtDonk » Thu Jun 20, 2013 11:54 pm

Hey Icelandic! Thanks for updating things for us. Glad you're enjoying it during this time.

Just for clarification, to make sure it's still a stock type radiator, we use "right" for the passenger side. All descriptions are as seen from the driver's seat, rather than as you're looking at it from the front of the vehicle.
So with that in mind, a stock original type upper radiator hose would run from the front of the engine over to the top left, or driver's side of the radiator.
The lower radiator hose runs from the outlet on the lower right (passenger side) of the radiator, to the inlet on the water pump, also facing the passenger side.

All this assumes that the Broncos sold in Iceland are left-hand drive? Sorry I'm not familiar with which side of the road you use and don't remember if you mentioned it.
Or if Broncos were ever even available with right hand drive at all!

Does all that sound correct for your Bronco? If not, then the radiator and hoses could have been changed over the years to whatever was available.

Paul
'71 Bronco - 302 4v
3.5" WH/Skyjacker Lift
33 x 11.50 x15 Thornbirds on 15x7 Enkei's
Kayline soft top
Hanson bumpers
Dual batteries, Large 1G alt.

WWW.WILDHORSES4X4.COM :mrgreen:

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Post by DirtDonk » Thu Jun 20, 2013 11:58 pm

Oh, and I'm not sure we send stuff your way or not either. I think something like this can be sent through the Post Office, but I know we've had trouble with product sent out of the country before, so it might be we no longer offer this service.
I can find out for you on Monday, or you could e-mail directly to the store at sales@wildhorses4x4.com and get a reply quicker.

We do have a customer who I think is from your country, but who's sister lives here in California and sends him Bronco goodies on occasion. If I remember though, it's not sent by mail. They wait for family members and friends to visit here and let them take the parts back with them!
Very effective I would say.

Paul
'71 Bronco - 302 4v
3.5" WH/Skyjacker Lift
33 x 11.50 x15 Thornbirds on 15x7 Enkei's
Kayline soft top
Hanson bumpers
Dual batteries, Large 1G alt.

WWW.WILDHORSES4X4.COM :mrgreen:

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Post by Arsenio » Fri Jun 21, 2013 8:06 am

Well if someone pays for ticket i will fly over and deliver parts. I will even gift wrap them like they are presents. I will make my own sleeping arrangement's if that helps. And i will make myself available for possible install of parts as long as tools are provided.
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Post by Tom Dummer » Fri Jun 21, 2013 9:28 am

You might ask for a HEATED shop. looks cold there.
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Post by IcelandicBroncoFan » Fri Jun 21, 2013 2:18 pm

DirtDonk wrote:Hey Icelandic! Thanks for updating things for us. Glad you're enjoying it during this time.

Just for clarification, to make sure it's still a stock type radiator, we use "right" for the passenger side. All descriptions are as seen from the driver's seat, rather than as you're looking at it from the front of the vehicle.
So with that in mind, a stock original type upper radiator hose would run from the front of the engine over to the top left, or driver's side of the radiator.
The lower radiator hose runs from the outlet on the lower right (passenger side) of the radiator, to the inlet on the water pump, also facing the passenger side.

All this assumes that the Broncos sold in Iceland are left-hand drive? Sorry I'm not familiar with which side of the road you use and don't remember if you mentioned it.
Or if Broncos were ever even available with right hand drive at all!

Does all that sound correct for your Bronco? If not, then the radiator and hoses could have been changed over the years to whatever was available.

Paul
Hello, and thanks for the reply.

I mean the left side then! I've found the hose which I need on your site : http://www.wildhorses4x4.com/product/Up ... iator_Hose

It is a stock radiator.

We drive on the right side of the road here, and our Bronco is a left hand drive :)

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